Retitled: China offers arms to the Philippines

[adroth]

Offer made but nothing definite on gun sale from China —DND
Published December 12, 2016 2:54pm

The Department of National Defense on Monday confirmed that China has offered weapons to the country but could not give details on what firearms were being peddled and by what firm.

“May offer lang sila," said Undersecretary Raymundo Elefante, the DND undersecretary for finance, munitions, installations, and material.

Asked what kinds of guns were being offered, he said, "That’s to be determined pa or something like that. Hindi ko masabi kung anong specific."

He also cannot say which company will supply the firearms.

- See more at: http://www.gmanetwork.com/news/story/592150/news/nation/offer-made-but-nothing-definite-on-gun-sale-from-china-dnd#sthash.1KIytcXP.dpuf

[israeli]

China offers $14-M arms package to PH - Lorenzana
Reuters
Posted at Dec 20 2016 02:53 PM

MANILA - China has offered to provide $14 million worth of small arms and fast boats to the Philippines for free, aiding President Rodrigo Duterte's war on drugs and fighting terrorism, Manila's defense minister said on Tuesday.

The offer was made by China's ambassador Zhao Jianhua during a meeting with Duterte late on Monday night at the presidential palace, Delfin Lorenzana said, adding Beijing has also made available $500 million long-term soft loan for other equipment.

"China has given us a list of military equipment and we will go through it to find out what we really need," Lorenzana told reporters after giving out Christmas gifts to wounded soldiers at an army hospital in Manila.

"We might get some small arms, fast boats and night vision goggles because $14.4 million is not that much. We will finalize the deal before the end of the year and a technical working team will soon go there to look at the equipment."

Lorenzana said they hope to get the Chinese armaments by the second quarter next year. "The Chinese ambassador last night told the president, I know your problem in drugs so we would like to help you," he added.

<snipped>

[spoon]

Its seems this offer is moving forward. If the DND would have a choice of firearms to choose from ( taking out the AK/type56 series as these are not 5.56 caliber and non STANAG magazine compatible ). Choices would be:

Norinco QBZ-97A/B series (which is 5.56 nato and accepts STANAG magazines )

QBZ-97A



QBZ-97B



Norinco QBZ-03 (5.56 nato and accepts any stanag magazines )



Norinco CQ 5.56mm Type A Assault Carbine (m4 unlicensed copy and currently used by the BJMP and some LGUs for law enforcement duties )



and the less likey pick

Norinco Model 311

[LionFlyer]

Its seems this offer is moving forward. If the DND would have a choice of firearms to choose from ( taking out the AK/type56 series as these are not 5.56 caliber and non STANAG magazine compatible ). Choices would be:

Long arms of the 5.56m calibre doesn't seem particular lacking, given the R4 replacement for front line units and old M16A1s that  they replaced which could be refurbished by GA.

How about sidearms or crew served weapons ?

[mamiyapis]

Three words:

Hammer Forging Machine.

Delivered to the GA, with technical support for the next 5 years, and maybe a few 5-axis CNC machines to produce mandrels and spares for the hammer forge.

Also, tech transfer on rockets, specifically the ability to produce RPGs and 2.75" rockets independently. If they're feeling generous, then some facilities to make our own 76mm cannon shells.

Why depend when you can independ.

[adroth]

Three words:

Hammer Forging Machine.

Delivered to the GA, with technical support for the next 5 years, and maybe a few 5-axis CNC machines to produce mandrels and spares for the hammer forge.

Also, tech transfer on rockets, specifically the ability to produce RPGs and 2.75" rockets independently. If they're feeling generous, then some facilities to make our own 76mm cannon shells.

Why depend when you can independ.

Now you're talking 

It's worth noting that most of the GA's original machines were actually Japanese, c/o of war reparations. The US never gave us equipment for self-manufacture

[sirius]

The QBZ-97 has a flat top version which might be better for compatibility with optics mounts

[Invictus]

DND to tailor equipment list to fit into Chinese 100-M yuan grant

MANILA, Dec. 22 (PNA) -- Department of National Defense (DND) Secretary Delfin Lorenzana said they are now tailoring the list of equipment which they intend to acquire under China's one-time grant worth 100 million yuan.

“We at the DND and Armed Forces of the Philippines are still preparing our list,” he added.

“We do not know yet the quantities, but we are looking at fast boats, drones, night vision goggles, and communications equipment," Lorenzana stressed.

<snipped>

The Chinese envoy conveyed that the grant is China’s support to the President’s war on illegal drugs and terrorism.

<snipped>

It was also mentioned earlier that the $USD 500M loan is intended for big-ticket items.

The Chinese government also offered a low-interest long-term loan amounting to USD500 million.

Lorenzana said the DND will study the offer vis-ŕ-vis the current AFP Modernization Program. (PNA)
BNB/PFN

[Invictus]

AFP welcomes military aid from China despite West PHL Sea Dispute

Despite Chinese activities in Philippine-claimed territories in the South China Sea, the Armed Forces of the Philippines (AFP) on Thursday said it welcomes the more than P700 million ($14 million) in military aid being offered by China.

"Bilang isang bansa kinikilala po natin ang ating pakikipagkapit-bansa. Kung meron pong naghahatid ng tulong o naghahandog ng tulong sa atin base sa ating pangangailangan, wala naman po sigurong masama kung ito ay ating titingnan at ating tatanggapin bilang isang kapwa bansa," -- AFP Public Affairs Office chief Col. Edgard Arevalo said.

<snipped>

[miggye]

Sirius, the AFP and the PNP have serious reservations about the QBZ. One of them being that the Gun is not ambidextrous, meaning that 15-18% of the AFP would have to undergo serious retraining to handle a Right Handed rifle.....

[SG99n1]

Lesson learn coming from the Thais about chinese equipment
https://www.facebook.com/Bulldog.434.Cliffhanger/posts/10210534411857500

...With a pro-China Thai government taking over in 2001, Thailand once again turned to the PRC as a source of arms. In 2001 the Defense Ministry agreed to buy Chinese-manufactured rocket propelled grenade launchers and in December 2002 placed a $98 million order for two Thai-designed offshore patrol vessels (OPVs). The two vessels—Pattani and Narathiwat—were delivered in late 2005. However, further offers by China to sell a range of defense equipment to the Kingdom failed to materialize. This included a follow-on order for two OPVs and an unspecified number of main battle tanks, while a proposed barter exchange deal involving 66,000 tons of dried Thai Longan fruit for Chinese-made APCs also fell through (instead Thailand purchased APCs from South Africa). Resistance from the Thai military on quality grounds was one reason for the failure to secure further orders.
As for Thailand's procured weapons from China, the unreliable Type-69 main battle tanks acquired in 1987 were withdrawn from service after a short service with the Thai Army, many were dumped in the sea to serve as artificial reefs and to improve the eco system. The Chinese warships are now mostly equipped with western naval weapons systems, communications and sensors replacing the primitive and unreliable Chinese systems. Chinese made 130mm artillery pieces were also placed on reserve status....

[LionFlyer]

The article is rather one sided. The Thai Army ordered new VT4 MBTs recently and DTI (Thailand's defence agency) maintain deep ties with China for the transfer of technology, specific for the Wanshan series surface to surface rockets.

[sirius]

Sirius, the AFP and the PNP have serious reservations about the QBZ. One of them being that the Gun is not ambidextrous, meaning that 15-18% of the AFP would have to undergo serious retraining to handle a Right Handed rifle.....

That's good to hear. I'm really not in favor of that rifle... if the AFP/PNP were to get a bullpup I would take the SAR21 over the QBZ-97. Though I would still prefer the M4/M16 over either...

[adroth]

PH submits defense equipment wishlist to China
Defense Chief Delfin Lorenzana says they are waiting for China to approve the list which includes boats and drones

Pia Ranada
@piaranada
Published 5:57 PM, February 07, 2017
Updated 6:50 PM, February 07, 2017

http://www.rappler.com/nation/160746-defense-equipment-list-submitted-china

MANILA, Philippines (UPDATED) – The Philippines has submitted to China the list of defense equipment it hopes Beijing can supply through a $14-million grant, Defense Secretary Delfin Lorenzana said on Tuesday, February 7,

"Na-formalize namin 'yan...Meron na tayong listahan doon eh (It has been formalized...We already have a list that is with them)," Lorenzana said in an interview with reporters in Malacańang on Tuesday, when asked about the list of defense equipment.

He said he gave the list of equipment to Chinese Ambassador Zhao Jianhua "3 weeks ago."

Once China approves the funding, a representative of the Philippine government will go to China

< Edited >

Asked whether the wish list includes precision-guided munitions, Lorenzana said, "Yes." He added, "We asked for many things – boats, drones."

But in a text to Rappler, Lorenzana said the precision-guided munitions are in a list of equipment to be covered by a $500 million soft loan, not the $14 million grant.

He specified that the Philippines is asking for precision-guided munitions, not missiles, which are more "sophisticated."

Precision-guided munitions are satellite-guided munitions designed to hit a specific target. Lorenzana said PGMs will "lessen" casualties, compared to the use of unguided bombs.

< Edited >

[redcomet_m]

PGMs? is it an educated guess to assume that the drones would be the platform for those munitions? i cant see them being on the wish list boats lest they want their own pgms raining on their boats.